Monday, March 22, 2010

Restoration without genuine repentance: of Liardon, Bentley, Haggard and co

Moriel’s Jacob Prasch in his usual forthright manner has breached a hot topic affecting the Church in the United States. Not only are highly visible leaders in the Church falling from grace to grass, in their desperate attempts to stage dubious come-backs, they are putting ministry and self ahead of holiness and the Gospel. The result is that Christianity is being further derided among unbelievers, while many unstable Christians are embracing the new watered- down standards of their idols. Titled “What do Ted Haggard, Todd Bentley, and Roberts Liardon all have in common?”, Prasch listed three facts which should provide food for thought for the Church:

* All either compromised with false doctrine or preached it even before their public falls from grace.

*All have an exposed history of homosexuality while claiming to oppose homosexuality.

* All have constructed bogus doctrinal justifications for returning to the ministry. [http://moriel.org/MorielArchive/index.php/discernment/church-issues/false-prophets/haggard-bentley-liardon-and-company]

It was in 2002 that Roberts Liardon, pastor of Embassy Christian Center in Irvine, California, and influential Pentecostal author (including of the book God’s Generals), confessed to a long-term homosexual relationship with his associate youth pastor. Not only was he back in the ministry within weeks of the confession, he has more recently been announced by Colin Dye as the new head of Kessington Temple’s International Bible Institute of London. His mandate is to “train a new generation of leaders”.

Todd Bentley’s story was featured extensively on the pages of Church Arise! beginning from the height of his so-called “revival” which we felt could easily spill over to the Church in Nigeria – especially among the youths. (Vol 11 Nos 3&4, 2008). However, even while the so- called ‘revival’ was still on-going,
Todd abandoned his wife and three children, and ran off with a ministry staff who he has since married! Despite such warped theology, clear demon-inspired ministry, and unsurprising serious character flaw and immorality; after a brief suspension, Todd Bentley is back in ministry - together with the woman he ran off with, courtesy of strong backings from Rick Joyner. [A case of birds of the same feather flocking together, no doubt!] Meanwhile, as pointed out by Prasch, “Bentley's three children languish at home in Canada with his biblically rightful wife while Joyner shamefully applauds the spectacle.”

Ted Haggard’s case was a big-time disaster for evangelical Christianity in the United States (see Vol 9 No 6, and Vol 11 No 6). Prasch summarises the situation: “The former President of the National Association of Evangelicals, who was already consorting with doctrinally off-base figures, was involved with paying male prostitutes for unnatural sex and taking dangerous intoxicating drugs recreationally. And then lied through his teeth about it to his church. All of a sudden, he is supposedly "restored".”

Several other unfortunate cases that could be cited include Paul Crouch of Trinity Broadcasting Network (TBN). Although Crouch vociferously denied the charges of homosexual affairs with an employee, he in 1998, agreed to pay $425,000 in an out-of-court legal settlement to this man. The payment required the recipient remain silent about charges of the deviant sexual behavior. http://www.politicalbyline.com/2009/04/08/the-reading-room-recent-pentecostal-scandals/


Now, the issue is not that Christians who backslide should not be restored, but rather on what conditions and in what time frame, especially when restoration is being sought into leadership roles? One authority Collin Dye has used to justify his restoration of Liardon to leadership role, is the narrative of the Old Testament where God forgave David for his sin with Bathsheeba. Aside of several problems with this analogy, a key factor is the godly sorrow and genuine repentance exhibited by David. These ingredients have not been obvious in the contemporary situations under discussion. As a matter of fact, Ted Haggard, (probably attempting to model Bill and Hillary Clinton), has encouraged his wife to write a book on the whole saga, which is being used to generate sympathy from non-spiritual folks. 'I love a good redemption story,' a supporter was quoted. However, a critical commentator, The Phoenix Preacher [http://phoenixpreacher.com/] wrote on his blog: “Would it not be more prudent to go into obscurity and work on their marriage?“

Haggard’s former church affirms that he spurned the restoration process by quitting the stipulated counseling sessions in early 2008. Not only does this suggest a hardening of the heart, Haggard’s choosing to set up his new church only a few miles of the old Church has been described by other leaders as “insensitive and premature” According to Larry Eskridge, associate director of the Institute for the Study of American Evangelicals at Wheaton College in Illinois: "The larger question is the inability [of Haggard] to put himself under someone else's authority and whether it shows true repentance."
[http://www.latimes.com/news/nation-and-world/la-na-ted-haggard7-2009dec07,0,2372048.story

In his article, Jacob Prasch wrote: “No one suggests that a fallen brother or sister who truly repents cannot be forgiven and restored to fellowship, but once they no longer can have a good name otion with those outside of the church, 1 Timothy teaches clearly that they can no longer be restored to ministry or leadership. …… If someone in such an unfortunate situation truly repented, they would accept the ramifications of their misdeeds, do all they could to make amends, and abide by the teachings of Scripture that prohibits them from being in further ministry or leadership.

“We are forced to conclude” Prasch further wrote, “ either that their repentance is therefore disingenuous and malmotivated or else they are so fundamentally ignorant of God's Word that they should never have been in the ministry at all to begin with.”
[http://moriel.org/MorielArchive/index.php/discernment/church-issues/false-prophets/haggard-bentley-liardon-and-company]

21 comments:

Anonymous said...

I dont know who wrote this article...some moves of these pastors could have been wrong but who ever says once you fall as a minister, you can no longer get back to ministerial or leadership position is wrong, unscriptural and contradicts the purpose of the death of Jesus Christ. please let us not be a stumbling block to the restoration process of believers. I strongly believe it must be genuine, contrite and thorough but not absolute banishment as no physical remorse (sorrow) can work godly repentance.

Anonymous said...

Truly i agree that any man can be restored. But the fact remains in the question asked above 'what time frame and what is the attitude of the person?' a biblical example of David to justify Roberts deed doesnt seem justifiable because the first that we see in David is his genuine repentance and the fact that he was willing to pay for what he did, when the adulterous son died, he saw it as a justification of his wrong. The other example in the New testament of a man who is not even in ministry is that of the man in the corinthian church whom Paul told them to 'cast out of the church for the destruction of his flesh' and he later asked them to recieve him back after repentance and he saw his true offence. Did we see this in this men? A man that must be in ministry according to the book of Titus must be able to contro his orgies and even submit to others. These are the true marks of leaders of the flock.

Anonymous said...

I am really sorry sir/madam, but your tongue needs to be restored
Who are you to say that there was no genuine restoration? Are you God?
Remember what happened to David... if people at those times looked in the same way you look, they would say there wasn't a genuine restoration.
God, who knows our hearts (including mine and yours)made David known as "a man according God's heart".
So, shut up!!
People like you also discourage God's kingdom!!

Anonymous said...

If a person is genuinely repentive then they will complete the process that was mapped out (and agreed to) as a part of the restorative process. In most of these cases (most, not all) the offender bypassed the process in an effort to be restored prematurely.

Vicwise Ose said...

I strongly believe that first of all this article should not have been posted in order not to shake the faith of other believers. I believe that judgment for all the activities of Men anointed of God as spiritual leaders is to God and not to man, by this we incur the wrath of God. Know their lives should not be to you the word of God you study to build your relationship with God. Christianty is a personal race and relationship with God and not with men. Thus pray for them that they be restored wholly for the kingdom of God. This is our sole duty for every member of God's family

Anonymous said...

Does not anyone ever ask WHY these guys are so adament about returning to positions of "ministry" and "leadership". It's as simple as it gets ... MONEY. Where else can they earn a 6 or 7 figure income? Exactly ... Nowhere. Its why they spurn genuine submission in nearly 100% of cases and head back to the printing press, itenary, and board room. Car selling, school teaching, and /or a real daily job will never bring back that lavish lifestyle. Whoever cannot see that is not paying attention.

Jaziz Hallas said...

I was a student at Liardon's school and I was there when he announced his sin. I will quote him the best as I can, "I know you have been hearing some rumors and I wanted to let you know that they were true. I have been having a homosexual relationship with the youth Pastor John. I will be getting counseling and I will be back in 3 months." No repentance. No sorrow. No nothing. I left that ministry and I never looked back. The teacher's had been disappearing and we had no idea what was happening. We felt so betrayed.

Anonymous said...

"I am the chiefest of sinners."

"Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness..."

"Am I not an apostle? am I not free? have I not seen Jesus Christ our Lord? are not ye my work in the Lord? "

"If I be not an apostle unto others, yet doubtless I am to you: for the seal of mine apostleship are ye in the Lord."

"You intended to harm me, but God intended it for good to accomplish what is now being done, the saving of many lives."

What man meant for evil, God uses for good. If Paul is good enough for the Spirit, he is good enough to preach and write God's word for me!

stephen. H. said...

Jacob Prasch is no way to be listened to on the restoration on any one. He has wrote articles on nearly every preacher known on this planet. He constantly refers to those who fall as those who have " FALLEN FROM GRACE". But Paul uses this phrase in Galatians 5 about those who use the law as a means to staying in Christ. Jacobs foolishness really has been that he holds to his Jewish roots so strongly that he mixes the law with the grace of God and he in himself excludes himself from the gospel of grace. In fact those who fall whether big or small have not fallen from grace , but fallen into grace. I'm ashamed at the madness of these legalistic preachers of the gospel. If the truth be known about what goes on in there hearts , week, I'm sure hell would shudder. Good on you Colin Dye for restoring such a MSN of God but more than that a brother in the Lord.

Anonymous said...

I belive that the primary purpose an article like this should be written should be to edify and bring growth to the body of Christ. The writer needs to ensure that his motive for the article submits to that standard. Kindly remember that there are thousands of people out there including Muslim scholars, satanists, backslide people and bitter people with an agenda against the Church of Jesus. When we write kindly ensure you are factual, edifying to those who read so that the wayward are warned and the foolish become wiser. You just sounded like someone who just needed to write but lacked a mandate and so had to create one. If you a as born again person just remember that we don't kick the wounded and if your motive was to school the unlearned you failed in that regard.

Research a matter said...

Anonymous: most of that person who is defending lie, doesn't know what Talking aboutt, not mature and doesn't understand "Biblical Church Disicipline" by Daniel Wray or Bible. Defending their leader because following/worshipping man over God/Jesus/Holy Spirit sad to say (most of the time in abusive ministry and don't see it).
Confirm this Blog Post, have you ever met the people that God/Jesus/Holy Spirit sent for two years prior to the fall? Blog is. Right, these that were named did NOT submit to mandated Authority and counseling. Didn't those leaders take ads out in Charisma against Like Paul Cain and Ted Haggard? Colin Dye was wrong for intercepting what God wanted to do. Met the woman that. Or reacted Haggard and she was thrown out of the church along with others. What's sad is God T.V. Backing Todd with no discernment along with the thousands that flocked to meetings.

Read: Don't Call Me Brother by Austin Miles (2nd book "setting the Captives Free),, Losing My Religion by William Lobdell, (pay attention to what he says about preacher's/leader's), Cages of Pain by Gordon Aeschliman, Pagan Christianity by Frank Viola (Green Cover only; red cover with cowriter); Subtle Power of Spiritual Abuse by Johnson//Van Vonderan, all books by Arthur Katz and Leonard Ravenhill, Blue Print by Clifford James, Churches That Abuse by Ron Enroth, Salvation for Sale by Gerard T. Straub, Sons of Zadok, C.R. Oliver, Tale of Three Kings by Gene Edwards, The Unholy Anointing, H.a Lewis, Pigs in Parlor by Frank/Ida Mae Hammond, Howard Snyder Books, especially Wineskins, breaking Christian Curses by Dennis Cramer, Toxic Faith by Stephen Arterburn, Will the Real Heretics Please Stand Up by David Bercot. Strong Man"s His Name, What"s His Game by Jerry/Carol Robeson. 10 Lies the Church Tells Women/10 Lies Men Believe by J.L. Grady. Watch DVDs, Lord Save Us From Your Followers, UTube: losing my Religion 1 hr. 3 min. Video;, book is awesome. , Marjoe Documentary also. Cages of Pain MUST READ on pharisical church we are supporting.

Most sheep don't question foundations of their leader (history), where the tithe money goes, who they help; meaning tithe going to fatherless, widow, orphan, poor, alien, stranger, homeless etc. we tithe, don't question if they're in sin or that they are building a kingdom to self and God Does NOT get any money as you're robbing your families. Even though Dick VanSutphen's Christian Brainwashing is little new agy, it's correct. Most Christians are brainwashed idiots that cannot, will not and choose not to think for themselves, they're supporting and celebrating liars. Why Apostolic/Prophetic isn't major foundation. We don't know what real and true church looks like. Type in Trouble Makers in the Church by David Wilkerson and do those reads. Google Annunk site and read all the comments about controlling, abusive leaders. Trinity Foundation in Dallas Tx has been trying to expose TBN, Benny Hinn, Joyce Meyer, Pat Robertson, so has David Wegmer in his DVD and Christians still keep them in there hideous lifestyle. They would have to work hard and for years to collect their salaries while they live your money and stupidity of worshipping man over Jesus. Read:repentbethelredding.com by Tony Miano and do those reads along with Mike Bickle's evil regime. Also, cults always go after the youth. Somewhere there is post definition of a cult, much of false church/leader's today.

Research a matter said...

P.S. Correction: David Wegner's Dvd on B. him and John Bloom's article on same. Also, Los Angeles Times has done many an article and so-called Christians tithe and attend.

If you want to know about your church or leaders: abused by name of pastor and church
Controversial articles by name of pastor/church
People's negative feedback name of pastor and church
Scandal of pastor or name of church. What's sad is they still exist off your hard earned money and time, God doesn't get any money and they usually lie about who they help and where it goes. Been at it for over 50 years to no avail. California has a lot of stupid people to keep all these charlatans in their lifestyle. Above reads are excellent. Get unbrainwashed and think for yourself.

Thank you for posting this Blog and looking out for souls of men who want to live in truth.

Always research a matter. said...

Majority of Post who do not want these leaders corrected or exposed like Vicwise is wrong. This article should be posted for following reasons: WHAT DOES SCRIPTURE SAY?

Have any of you question what they own, worth, how many Houses, Cars, planes, Vacation Homes, Ranches, Property (like read 6 pages of September 19-20, 2004 article on TBN by William Lobdell along with "Onward Christian Soldier". Haven't you seen Video of B. Hinn and Paul Crouch damning (cursing) people who come against their ministry. It's THEIR Ministry, God has no hand in it. One is Posted on David Wilkerson's website and George Barna writes about Paul Crouch and you can see that on some U-Tube video. One definition of a cult is "complete and utter disdain for correction", definitely those two. For the people who tithe to all these false ministry's your paying their Mortgage and Bills/Debt, Dreams and Lifestyle, Children's Private/college Education but they 're not paying yours.
How do you justify Benny Hinn making 90 million a year and no one questions what he does with the money? Trinity Foundation, Dallas TX has those figures.
Would you tithe/support a man that says "if you leave my ministry you will die" (operating more like a warlock) in book "Ashes to Gold by Patti Roberts. Cursing rather than blessing and operating in manipulation and control and emotional blackmail=Charismatic Witchcraft and Jezebel behavior=Oral Roberts. Assemblies of God operate like this as well as many others, very evil regime.
Pastors rather murder their lovers whether they be male/female because they have a name to protect, money coming in the way they want and YOU ARE NOT GOING TO MESS WITH THAT at all, their kingdom that they are building. This was addressed to over 350 heads of church leadership for years and It would be exposed in Book: Losing My Religion by Wm Lobdell. So, So, So sad what the church has become let along the Nation.
"This Generation of Preacher's is responsible for this generation of sinner's" Leonard Ravenhill. Battle Hymn by Secura/Phillips would expose corrupt NWO preacher's along with Marketing of Evil by David Kupelian and H.A. Lewis in Unholy Anointing. Rebecca Brown would also expose corrupt church in "He Came To Set Captives Free". Is your pastor/church going after prostitute, homeless, poor, fatherless, widow, orphan, broken-hearted. All pastor's should be working and not living off people or church (attend a ministry that NO pastor takes salary it all goes to helping people, servant oriented ministry). Preaches Bible and not dead verbiage/rhetoric.

If pastor falls, minimum of two years out in counseling NOT of his choice (like the ones mentioned, Blog was right to expose/mention..
Correction: met woman corrected Haggard and got thrown out and same for the other mentioned. David Wilkerson took care of Todd in Florida. There has been a church correction list of report church abuse since 2000. Maybe Tony Miano will post.

Anonymous said...

I would want us to feel with the Lord when He is seeing all that is going on in the body of His. Rather than exchange endless legalistic arguments to justify what and why we are right, we should just do what our Lord Jesus did for Peter in Luke 22:31-32 “31 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat: 32 But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren”. Let us pray for ourselves because a fallen brother could receive strength to see his actual state when he is prayed for. God bless you all.

Rich S said...

Most of these comments are a sad commentary to the authority of God's Word. The question isn't about being forgiven or restored to the body of Christ, but what the Bible says about a church leader who is involved in serious sin that dishonors Christ and the Church in a public and despicable way. In short, we forgive and receive the repentant, but they are barred from further spiritual leadership. It's a no-brainer Biblically, but because the Bible really isn't an authority for many, confusion abounds and the world laughs at us. May God's Word guide and direct us!

Anonymous said...

king David was a king, and not a pastor, prophet , (he didn't have that position) or any kind of spiritual leader. Pastors are, therefore they can not be practising homosexualism. They lead other homosexuals sinning if they don't take a strict opposition against it. Is he married? no. Is he looking for a wife? If not, Why not? Therefore I don't believe he is cured if people say he is . Show me he 's married to a woman and has biological kids and I believe his restoration. What's his opinion about gay marriages? He comes across as very arrogant person (based on his facebook coments) He says britissh are socialists, and something how we should not care for disabled people as much or something like that.

Always research a matter: said...

Rich S. Appreciated your comment. The 10/15/2015 post by Anonymous, I used to be a brainwashed rose colored glass person who wanted to believe the best but I've seen the evil/ugly side of Ministers as in 10 Lies The Church Tells Women by J. Lee Grady and violently killing sheep metaphorically speaking destroying people to protect their dynasty and control issues.
Wonder how long God is going to let them prostitute and whore his name and who he is giving people/world warped view of the Father.
2 Peter 3:9 for pastors/people playing God and praying for people to die and cursing them with Cancer that they control or usurping their will over others=witchcraft in the church. So sad. Watch DVD: Lord, Save Us From Your Followers by Dan Merchant.

Anonymous said...

I was at the International Bible Institute of London when Roberts Liardon & a team visited in 2000. I wasn't a fan then, andi was unsurprised when his announcement of homosexual relations was made 2 years later...it was evident to me at the time that he had unusual affection for his youth pastor. When we live in a world that idolises celebrities, it's no wonder such idolisation transfers to celebrity preachers, leading to self-aggrandisement and unwillingness to submit to the Word of God. I'm disappointed, but unsurprised, that Colin Dye has elevated Liardon to head of IBIOL...after all, he does not reject the idolatrous worship of himself & his "ministry" by members of his congregation; in fact, I would suggest he encourages and promotes it. Liardon simply slots in well to that self-gratification ethos, and feeds the ego.

Unknown said...

Thanks for this. Will definitely be reading!

Anonymous said...

Thanks for your comment. I attend a London City Church (not KT) but have always felt uneasy about Colin Dye.

Beauty for Ashes said...

u hit the nail on the head.